Ban porn and modernise sentencing guidelines

General and Other Policy
1

Porn is harmful to those who watch it. It is immoral, teaches wrong ideas and attitudes and can become addictive. The brain becomes resistant to the images and so more and more extreme porn has to be consumed in order for gratification to be achieved and this can unfortunately lead to the consumption of sadomasochistic and child porn.

Porn is harmful to those involved in making it. Most if not all women who partake in it have been abused, sexually assaulted, had no love as a child or had an abusive parent, are dependent on drugs, are slaves or destitute etc. I don’t know too much about the industry but it does seem to me that it is as abhorrent, abusive, exploitative as, say, drug gangs which we as a society try to be rid of.

The Sexual Offences Act 2003 was written at a time when the internet was in its infancy. Amendments to the Act were made in 2015 but I would suggest they don’t go far enough or really take into consideration what we have learnt about paedophilia and online pornography in the last ten years. I can’t believe Huw Edwards isn’t in prison right now. If he and others didn’t demand, it wouldn’t be supplied and children and women (and probably men) wouldn’t be used to create content. The considerations in sentencing regarding remorse and mental health seems laughable in this case. Also, the idea that Huw got it out of his system and will never do it again is frankly stupid.

Governments should be small and not interfere too much, however, it is my belief that it is out of control and something ought to be done.

ChatGPT said:

  1. Education and Awareness:

Comprehensive Sex Education: Focus on teaching young people about healthy relationships, consent, and emotional intimacy. This helps to counteract the unrealistic portrayals of sex often seen in pornography.

Media Literacy: Programs that educate individuals on how to critically engage with media, including recognizing the potential harms of pornography and its unrealistic depictions of sex, power dynamics, and relationships.

  1. Mental Health Support:

Addiction Support: For those who struggle with compulsive consumption, providing accessible mental health resources, addiction counseling, and support groups is crucial.

Therapeutic Interventions: Encouraging those who have become addicted to seek therapy or counseling to address the root causes of their behavior (whether it’s trauma, isolation, etc.) and develop healthier coping mechanisms.

  1. Stronger Regulation:

Content Moderation: Governments and tech companies can take steps to limit access to extreme and harmful content. This could include stricter age verification processes, as well as monitoring and removing illegal content such as child pornography.

Platform Responsibility: Social media platforms and adult websites should be held more accountable for ensuring they are not promoting exploitative content. This could include harsher penalties for platforms that allow the distribution of abusive or non-consensual material.

  1. Support for Those Affected in the Industry:

Welfare and Rehabilitation for Performers: Support systems should be set up for those involved in pornography, particularly women who may have experienced exploitation, abuse, or addiction. This could include access to healthcare, rehabilitation, housing assistance, and job opportunities outside of the industry.

Creating Alternative Work Opportunities: Programs that provide education and vocational training for people looking to leave the adult entertainment industry, helping them find healthier ways to support themselves.

  1. Public Discourse and Community Involvement:

Fostering Open Dialogue: Encourage a more open, honest, and nuanced conversation about the harms of pornography in society, especially in terms of how it can perpetuate unhealthy relationships and unrealistic expectations. This can include discussions in families, schools, and workplaces.

Faith-based or Community Programs: Some people find strength in religious or community-based approaches to combating addiction, promoting healthier sexual attitudes, and building supportive networks.

  1. Legislation:

Criminalizing Exploitative Content: Strengthening laws to penalize the production and distribution of exploitative material, particularly content that involves minors or non-consensual activities.

Taxation or Regulation of Adult Industry: Some countries have implemented specific taxes or regulations on the adult entertainment industry to fund programs that help those affected or to discourage exploitative practices.

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2

I agree completely Amy. Porn is so destructive in our society and is immoral. It doesn’t help that people prosecuted for possessing child porn aren’t punished sufficiently, which is disgusting. It contributes to normalising any type of porn. It should be banned so that people start to realise how dangerous it is for our society.

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We must resist the urge to simply outlaw everything one doesn’t like.

For all its supposed deleterious effects, pornography has existed since ancient times and did not prevent the founding of entire civilisations nor the innumerable scientific, technical and artistic achievements which define them.

Even if it were desirable, banning porn is virtually impossible. Child porn is illegal yet, as you yourself point out, still easily available to those who want it. What makes you think further prohibition will be more successful?

You openly state that you “don’t know too much about the industry” but still feel competent to offer, without evidence, sweeping claims that “most if not all” participants are abused, coerced, or in slavery. It should go without saying that this is not a sound basis for policy.

Slavery, assault, paedophilia, and the other issues you highlight are already, rightly, illegal. Seek out and punish those crimes where they occur. That they are often inadequately punished is a broader problem of criminal justice, and has nothing to do with porn.

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I know that pornography has been around since forever but the internet has not. The internet plus pornography is an experiment which is already proving to be more harmful than, say, porn videos in the 80s. I too believe we shouldn’t ban everything, however, when it comes to things which harm and exploit and go hand in hand with crime then I believe it should be banned. Would you want to legalise heroin?

I have watched plenty of documentaries and interviews, chatted with men who use it and women who have been sexually abused. I have been sexually assaulted throughout my entire life, childhood and adulthood. So, no, since I don’t produce or sell porn it doesn’t mean I don’t know how detrimental it is to women and children.

All of the experts and victims I have listened to confirm to me that you would be hard pushed to find a woman in a porn video who hasn’t been abused in childhood, wasn’t loved by her father, sexually assaulted, destitute or a slave etc. Should these women be exploited? Let’s face it, what woman who has had a stable upbringing would want to whore themselves? Females are not born slags!

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You still haven’t evidenced any of your original claims, nor countered any of my points. You’ve just added further, arguably even wilder unsupported claims.

I have watched plenty of documentaries and interviews, chatted with men who use it and women who have been sexually abused.

I like 24 Hours in Police Custody. That doesn’t mean my opinions on policing policy should be accepted without further justification or evidence.

since I don’t produce or sell porn it doesn’t mean I don’t know how detrimental it is to women and children.

I made no such claim.

All of the experts and victims I have listened to confirm to me that you would be hard pushed to find a woman in a porn video who hasn’t been abused in childhood, wasn’t loved by her father, sexually assaulted, destitute or a slave etc.

Merely reiterates your earlier, sweeping claim. Simply and absurdly adding that you have spoken to experts who fully endorse your view adds nothing.

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So women are born whores?

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I guess my experiences and knowledge mean I don’t know what I’m talking about. I guess I’m lying about expert opinions. I guess porn is just a part of life that women should just accept and bear the consequences of. I guess I’m too stupid to be on here. I didn’t realise this app was a professional only space.

8

Let us start with a very simple question “Do people grow up wanting to be porn stars/wanting to be prostitutes?” I feel like the obvious and only answer here is an emphatic and resounding no.
Why do people do it then? If they have not been sex trafficked, abused or coerced into it, they do it because they are desperate for money. These people might say that it is a one-time thing, that they are just getting enough to live off of, but we understand that this is how people get stuck in a particular lifestyle.

The vast majority of people will not hire a former porn-star. This means that entering the industry can trap you inside it. Furthermore, as more and more people enter the industry, supply and demand necessitate that prices get cheaper and that the pressure to do increasingly degrading things will only grow. Thus, people can be forced to consent to things that they would never consent to normally, just because they have no other way of making ends meet.

In this way, the industry itself and coercive and abusive. This is all just talking about the effects that pornography has on the actors, let alone the consumers and wider society.
As a society, we must sometimes protect people from themselves. Whilst a nuanced approach can be more effective at times, it is hard to justify such an approach on this issue. Taking a puritanical stance towards the sex industry, both the suppliers and the consumers, is the best way to protect society and to protect the men and women being forced into effective sex slavery by companies like OnlyFans.

9

Opinion presented without evidence.

Even if we assume your claim is true, you do not make clear why banning pornography is a necessary or desirable consequence. If all participants are, as you claim, “sex trafficked, abused or coerced into it”, all of these things are already illegal in the UK and so could and should be stopped.

The only other motivation you allow — “they are desperate for money” — is neither illegal nor peculiar to porn actors.

The vast majority of people will not hire a former porn-star.

Again, opinion without evidence. The rest of the argument is therefore pure conjecture.

Taking a puritanical stance towards the sex industry, both the suppliers and the consumers, is the best way to protect society

I repeat my earlier question. If this is true, why does child pornography still exist? How will your ban succeed where the banning of CP did not?

10

Firstly, one does not and need not provide evidence for everything that one claims. It is always reasonable to make suppositions based upon logic, common sense, and our general understanding of the world. The weight of these ideas comes from their commonly held validity and saying “Opinion presented without evidence” isn’t a gotcha, but makes you seem like a troll.

How this ban would work is that it is not intended to be entirely effective. It would be unreasonable to suggest that we can entirely eliminate pornography from society, merely that we can push it underground. I think that the stance that certainly I and likely @Amy take is that pornography is a societal acid. It dissolves the bonds between people and breaks down society. Sometimes, the effect of making something illegal is not to eradicate it, but to severely weaken it, such is the case here.

11

“Sometimes, the effect of making something illegal is not to eradicate it, but to severely weaken it, such is the case here.”

Prohibition in America not only didn’t weaken or eradicate drinking, but it strengthened the Mafia many fold. Likewise the prohibtion of drugs has had no affect on their usage, but empowered and made wealthy criminal and terrorist organisations.

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The thing is, if this were true in all cases, we could never ban anything. There would be an underground market for American eggs which are illegal in the UK by this logic
 but there isn’t.

“Prohibition does not work” is a great mantra, it’s piffy and doesn’t ask one to think too much. In reality, prohibition can work if people have suitible alternatives. In this case, the alternative is fixing society and helping people to get into relationships again. There is also something to be said about prohibition of substances vs. prohibition of media primarily spread on the internet.

Honestly, the internet may be the single most societally destructive force we have ever invented as humans.

13

You do if you wish to convince others that your claims are true, and the policy proposals based on them are sensible.

Not a single verifiable fact has been provided in support of this proposal.

Yes. Unfortunately your argument is predicated on several common logical fallacies: appeals to authority, appeals to common sense, hasty generalisations, ad hominem


Clearly it is, since you still cannot or will not provide any.

14

“The thing is, if this were true in all cases, we could never ban anything. There would be an underground market for American eggs which are illegal in the UK by this logic
 but there isn’t.”

There was no suggestion that banning things make them desirable. There is no market for American eggs and nobody would want them, legal or otherwise, but there are markets for alcohol, drugs and pornography. And that market will be supplied whether by legal means or otherwise. The real difference is that the criminals make far more money from banned commodities than legal ones.

“Prohibition does not work is a great mantra, it’s piffy and doesn’t ask one to think too much." But prohibition didn’t work. How much thought does it require?

“In reality, prohibition can work if people have suitible alternatives. In this case, the alternative is fixing society and helping people to get into relationships again.”

Now there is an example of a solution that really is piffy and doesn’t ask one to think too much. Pornography has existed for millennia, if society isn’t ‘fixed’ now it never will be, and do you think being in a relationship proscribes pornography?

15

No, but I think that pornography reduces the demand for building relationships.

I don’t doubt that, but if we can make it less accessible, we should be able to prevent teenagers from becoming addicted, prevent the social and emotional harm that being a porn star causes, and increase the prevalence of fertile relationships.

Do we at least agree that pornography, and the sexualisation of society, including the increasing sexualisation of children, is a negative for society and deeply damaging?

16

I see some pros and cons in the general arguments here (on both sides), however, one should NOT use ChatGPT for guidance on (small-c) conservative/right policies. It’s known to have a left-wing bias. Grok is much better, but still needs to be told to filter out left-wing ideology, and even then, must be read cautiously.

ChatGPT’s first recommendation, Comprehensive Sex Education (by the state), is extremely left wing, for example, and has led to (and is currently deepening) a lot of society’s current problems.

17

Sex is the oldest profession, prostitution is global and has been so for many 1000,s of years. The chances of wiping out prostitution are nil. Pornography is equally old And the Romans had a god for it. All you can do is clean it up like the German brothels. The sex trade in all its forms could be policed through a specific tax on the trade.